Ginny Marvin on PPC Mistakes, Leadership & Trust

Anu Adegbola (00:10)
This episode of PPC Live the Podcast is sponsored by Ad Squire. Adsquire are a small team of passionate and focused legal marketers that do what it takes to get law firms spectacular results with the landscape always changing. They stay on top of the strengths.

And are first to find and use new strategies to accomplish this for their clients. And so if you're a law firm, you definitely want to give them a call. They've been one of the, not one of the first, they've been the first to get to serve a lawyer ad on ChatGPT. And we know that even with all like the fact that it's very new, you really want to be testing some of these new strategies very early. And yeah, the Ad Squire team have got inside knowledge on how to do that and have started doing that.

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Anu Adegbola (01:12)
Hello and welcome to PPC Live the podcast. I'm your host, Anu, the founder of PPC Live. And nearly every week on the show, I speak to a different PPC expert about their biggest FUP and how they've turned things around. And we do then talk about the industry F ups and you know what people need to be doing better, especially in 2026. we share what was disappointing, how the story emerged, who was helpful, who was who was not too helpful, and just really where were the key learnings that turn things around and what they do.

Differently today, based on that incident that happened. This week I have the immense delight of having a chat with the Ginny Marvin, and you know, a lot of you will know her as being the Google Ads liaison of Google, you know, the you know, of and and being in the industry and just really sharing with us, you know, what's going on and really communicating with advertisers on behalf of Google.

She's she's been doing that for over two years. And but even before then, she was an account manager. She was someone who dealt with accounts, dealt with optimizations, was also, you know, sometimes the ones also battling with some of Google's updates and trying to figure out what was best to do in terms of implementing for her clients. So yeah, she talks us through one of those stories about working with an international client and you know the things she learns as to what to do, how to do with someone who has made that mistake as a leader and just how to move forward.

with a good relationship with a client after making a mistake. So yeah, let's go chat to Ginny

Anu Adegbola (02:43)
Hello Ginny welcome to PPC Live the podcast.

Ginny Marvin (02:47)
Thanks for having me, Anu. It's great to be with you.

Anu Adegbola (02:50)
no, I'm so delighted. You know, this this started off like a whole like you know, like my influencer style LinkedIn post, like, can we get Gini on the podcast? And I love the way I kind of made it seem like it would be a big deal. And you were just like, Yeah, I knew that be I mean. Yeah, yeah. I was like, okay,

Ginny Marvin (03:05)
I know. I think I answered with an emoji like deal.

Anu Adegbola (03:09)
let's do this. And I was like, that was so fun. And I just love Gini that that's

Always the the impression that you've you've given the what I've always perceived of you is that you're just so generous with time and generous with like you you know if you you need something about something even before your you know Google role, it's always been the case. So for those who don't know, the maybe one or two of you who don't know, let me introduce Jeannie to you. Jeannie is the ads product liaison at Google.

who she helps answer questions about how the Google ads, products, and policies work and bring marketers' insights and perspectives back to the team working on them. And I will genuinely say that we we noticed that because we noticed a shift in a bit of like the updates that were happening pre and post you joining Google. And I feel like a lot a lot of us like in the PPC chat on your audience, we're like,

Yeah, that's a genny thing. Ginny is Ginny is they're listening to Ginny. Thank God. We're there listening to Ginny. And so now we're like, okay, we'll go to Ginny with our issues and make sure we mention

Ginny Marvin (04:14)
Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (04:14)
Ginny. There's all our issues cause she will pass it on, right?

Ginny Marvin (04:17)
Yeah,

I would just one thing on that, because I don't want to take too much credit for that. I would say like there's there is a a real desire to listen to feedback that I've seen like gain traction. So

Anu Adegbola (04:31)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (04:31)
not just coming from me, but coming from all kind all various different sources from around the company, d standing up different roundtables and interview sessions and things like that.

Anu Adegbola (04:39)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (04:40)
So I'm glad to hear that. That's the perception. Great.

Anu Adegbola (04:42)
Yeah, fantastic. I mean, yeah, there's

been there's been a lot more of that. And I we yeah, I know it's not just you. I mean uncle unless it would have been a big fight if it had been just you. There it really did seem that there was like a willingness to be like, okay, a lot more round table, a lot more, you know, getting you know insights from more advertisers and yeah, it must be a team teamwork, team effort that's that has resulted in that. But you know, we are not here to actually talk about

you

know, Jeannie's time at Google. We're here to talk about Jeannie as well as a digital marketer because she's been in the industry for many years. How long now? I would say probably twenty, close to twenty.

Ginny Marvin (05:18)
I

was just doing the math and it's like twenty one years. Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (05:21)
Yeah, yeah. So

and you know, Google has only been about maybe a couple of years of that time, or is it two, three years? Yeah,

Ginny Marvin (05:27)
Yeah, like s yeah, it was new. Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (05:30)
exactly. So, you know, and yeah, Jeannie's got some fantastic great experience, has been quoted in the New York Times, in the Business Insider, Washington Posts, amongst different publications. I've I filled her very

big shoes at search engine land as being like, you know, a the, you know, the the the editor there, just chief editor there, did a fantastic work. Actually an interesting question I thought that I'd ask even at this stage, which cause you've done account management, you've done writing,

Ginny Marvin (06:00)
Mm.

Anu Adegbola (06:01)
which one do you feel like you like more?

Ginny Marvin (06:06)
I I like learning. I would say. Like as long as I'm learning,

Anu Adegbola (06:09)
Good, yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (06:12)
I am happy. And the writing sort of came accidentally.

Anu Adegbola (06:17)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (06:18)
and I wasn't sure I was one gonna be good at it and two that it would be a good fit. but I always kind of kept my hands in working with clients either behind the scenes or

Anu Adegbola (06:29)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (06:31)
and so that helped me

Anu Adegbola (06:33)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (06:33)
like

stay sort of in the in the know but also

Anu Adegbola (06:38)
Weeds to know.

Ginny Marvin (06:39)
yeah but the writing piece is fascinating and I'm sure you see this. It because you are having to stay on top of everything, you have a very broad breadth

Anu Adegbola (06:50)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (06:50)
of understanding across the ecosystem that

Anu Adegbola (06:53)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (06:54)
is really helpful. And also you can sort of lose track of like how hard it is to stay on top of everything because

Anu Adegbola (07:02)
Yes.

Ginny Marvin (07:03)
That's like your job. And so when people were

Anu Adegbola (07:05)
Yes.

Ginny Marvin (07:05)
like, wait, when what what change are you talking about? Like, that was two years ago. I mean, or you two months ago. Didn't you read my article? Yeah. But then

Anu Adegbola (07:08)
When combat jump? Yeah. Yeah. So about to go, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (07:14)
I realized, no, that is not right. Cause the number of times that I would say, I don't really remember that and search for it. And then my article would come up. And I'd be like, do I even remember writing that?

Anu Adegbola (07:24)
Mm-hmm. Am I by writing that? Absolutely.

Absolutely. I think I've actually even like written one and then Danny has gone. I know I'm pretty sure I wrote about that a few weeks ago. I've been like, yeah, we'll we'll link to it. We'll find a way of making it different. We'll link to each other's articles. Yeah, there's so much

Ginny Marvin (07:43)
Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (07:44)
going on. There's so much to learn. Okay. Well, yeah, we've we've had a very lovely introduction to Jinny there, but before we get into her talking about past mistakes.

I

always like getting my guests to share a fun fact about them. So, Jimmy, what's your fun fact?

Ginny Marvin (07:59)
my fun fact, maybe probably most people or a lot of people know that I like to be on the water, I like to sail. one thing that people may not know about me that's a little random is I ran my own pet products website for like five years.

Anu Adegbola (08:15)
wow.

Ginny Marvin (08:17)
and so kind of as a well, for a number of reasons, but anyway, so I learned a lot during during that process as well.

So yeah.

Anu Adegbola (08:26)
lovely.

What kind of pets? Are we like the full range of pets or?

Ginny Marvin (08:31)
honestly, it was I was I wan I thought it'd be interesting to obviously the pet industry is crazy competitive. And so

Anu Adegbola (08:38)
Yes.

Ginny Marvin (08:40)
I went niche into products for price specifically for senior pets.

Anu Adegbola (08:46)
Okay,

Ginny Marvin (08:48)
yeah. And and in doing that, I was I mean, this was sort of a side gig, but I was also managing all the customer service and taking all those calls. And so

Anu Adegbola (08:55)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (08:58)
you know, it was a it was a learning experience in

Anu Adegbola (09:00)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (09:01)
like such a number of of ways. So yeah.

Anu Adegbola (09:03)
Different ways. Yeah,

yeah. I feel like, you know, monitoring customer calls would have either a good prep for where you are right now in terms of monitoring other Google ad

Ginny Marvin (09:13)
Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (09:13)
advertisers telling you like what we want, what we don't like. And yeah, yeah, it's all about yeah, the customer service journey has has been long in your career. Okay, interesting. Okay, let's get to the story. I mean, like it's so great to you know, all the guests have come on. I I feel like you're the most influential of the

of

the people of of the guests that I've had so far, but there have been just so many fantastic people, so many fantastic stories. And you know, and we'll get more and hope I'm hoping this that gets people to be like, okay, if Genie can do it, so can I. So it's got this is a Yeah, there have been some great yeah, really great stories.

Ginny Marvin (09:43)
Yeah. N th you've had a lot of amazing guests, really and great stories, so fun to hear.

Anu Adegbola (09:49)
So we'll hand it over to you, Ginny. What's the F up you'd like to share with us today? Like one or two of them. Yeah. One, two, three, however many you want.

Ginny Marvin (09:55)
Okay. Well, the quick one that haunts

me that I don't really have much more to share on it, but it that I this happened very long ago pre smart bidding. and I changed I was in house. So at least I wasn't anyway, I was in house. And I changed a budget from I was trying to change it to seventy cents and I changed it to seventy dollars.

Anu Adegbola (10:17)
Okay. Oof ooh.

Ginny Marvin (10:20)
and this was before I and

I don't know if I was part of the impetus for making this change that Google now you have to make basically double click and it's you know, are you sure you want to make this

Anu Adegbola (10:28)
Yeah. Double check. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (10:32)
big bid change? but yeah, so that was a heart racing experience. Luckily it didn't it didn't run for very long. I caught it. It

Anu Adegbola (10:42)
Mm. All right.

Ginny Marvin (10:45)
was able to be sort of I wouldn't say absorbed in the budget, but I was able to explain it and we it

Anu Adegbola (10:49)
Okay. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (10:52)
It wasn't disastrous because at least I was in the campaigns regularly. But that is one of those things that comes back and like haunts my haunts my memories. Yeah. yeah.

Anu Adegbola (11:00)
no. All right. And yeah. Yeah. And if especially for the

fact that it was before smart bidding, I you know, I totally understand that where you're like, gosh, yeah, I'm the one that did that. You can't blame that on the Google system. You did that. The change history will show you. yeah.

Ginny Marvin (11:12)
Yes. I no. No. Yes. Yeah.

We weren't using any bid management system at that point. So yes. so that was a lot lessons in a lot of things. But the one I wanted to share is also an early days learning that that has sort of shaped my the way I approach a number of things in my

PBC work, but also in my in working with clients and team members and so again many years ago I was we had a client that was based in India and we were we'd been managing their campaigns or their their paid media for not that long, maybe a f maybe a few months.

And a junior member on our team, we were launching new campaigns, and she set the budgets incorrectly, and that meaning much higher than should have been.

Anu Adegbola (12:13)
Should I

Ginny Marvin (12:14)
And we woke up because of the time difference, we're in the States,

Anu Adegbola (12:16)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (12:17)
woke up to frantic emails, demands for calls.

Anu Adegbola (12:20)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (12:22)
and so we

It was a it was a lot of lessons in how to deal with somebody who's feeling terrible about a mistake they've made,

Anu Adegbola (12:32)
Yeah, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (12:34)
how to manage customer anger and frustration and rest

Anu Adegbola (12:39)
Mm. Mm-hmm.

Ginny Marvin (12:41)
restore trust.

Anu Adegbola (12:43)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (12:44)
so we, yeah, we got on the call with them, acknowledged the mistake. I think number one, like don't be defensive when there's

Anu Adegbola (12:51)
Yep. Yep.

Ginny Marvin (12:53)
when something's gone wrong, acknowledge the mistake, tried to explain it, but not over-explain it. The mistake is the mistake.

Anu Adegbola (13:00)
Yeah, okay. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (13:03)
And then just worked with them to say, okay, here's where we're starting from now. This is

Anu Adegbola (13:09)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (13:09)
what we have left for this. They were very budget constrained at that point. this is what we have for budget. This is how we're going to

make the most of it. We've got some we came with ideas and said, you know, we and acknowledge we know that we're gonna have to earn your trust back on

Anu Adegbola (13:29)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (13:29)
this. And so let's increase our frequency of communication. What

Anu Adegbola (13:33)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (13:34)
else do you want to see from us? And some of that doesn't mean just do whatever the client says. You know, if the client said, we want

Anu Adegbola (13:40)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (13:41)
to talk to you every hour, no. is that

Anu Adegbola (13:43)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Some people use that

Ginny Marvin (13:46)
you know, but

Anu Adegbola (13:47)
as an excuse to be like, okay, let's be as more as demanding as we can right now. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (13:52)
Yeah. so anyway, we and then s then obviously internally we regrouped and thought through processes a little bit differently, like let's put stringent

Anu Adegbola (14:00)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (14:03)
processes in. And and so yeah, it just it was a very good early learning experience

Anu Adegbola (14:10)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (14:11)
that we ended up having that client for many years. So it did not wreck the relationship.

Anu Adegbola (14:15)
Great.

Ginny Marvin (14:17)
And yeah, but it was very stressful in the moment.

Anu Adegbola (14:21)
Yeah, I'm sure. And actually

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I'm sure. And you know, something that's interesting that especially like that even happens much more. Well, a part of that story that I'm very interested in. I don't even think that has been brought up in other conversations is actually, yeah, working with international clients, working with people that are in different time zones and you know, and how you manage that to try to help, you know, mitigate things. Were there was there anything that was different that was more of like you

That

was because of the time zone different that you did differently because okay, their time zone is earlier. Let's make sure. Well, is there any way of being able to communicate to a client faster when you could be asleep? When they're sending an email? Like, you know, what are your tips for that?

Ginny Marvin (15:05)
Yeah, that's a really good question. and we we had a lot of international clients at that point. and we obviously you're figuring out when you're gonna schedule calls at a mutually beneficial time. and you we would we had launching cadences that would try to overlap as much as possible with the our overlapping time zones.

Anu Adegbola (15:29)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (15:30)
Sometimes that's hard.

but again, I think it's really more about that like fundamental, you know, setting expectations, being as communicative as possible. So

Anu Adegbola (15:42)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (15:43)
if they are going to wake up to a new whatever it's set of campaigns, or maybe we've launched new landing pages or whatever the changes are, that there's a clear outline of

Anu Adegbola (15:55)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (15:55)
what happened. and that can be through any mechanism now. Obviously there's Slack and all kinds of things. but yeah, I think it's really just about communication and putting yourselves in that the client shoes of

Anu Adegbola (16:10)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (16:11)
what's likely what else is likely going on in their day.

Anu Adegbola (16:14)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (16:16)
and when am I going to be most effective at

communicating with them, when and how, right? Like,

Anu Adegbola (16:21)
Favorite time. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (16:23)
so I think that's also just a good part of that initial onboarding of like, how do you like to communicate? Here's how we like to communicate and here's how here's how we do not communicate. You know, you also set guardrails of like you're not

Anu Adegbola (16:37)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (16:40)
calling me on my weekends or,

Anu Adegbola (16:42)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (16:43)
you know, whatever whatever it is, you know, have clear setting

Clear expectations of how you're gonna work together.

Anu Adegbola (16:50)
Absolutely. No, that's really great. And something also that I call I'm not sure whether that was just before we started recording or when we started we were recording, you were saying that some of the lessons that you would take away that people can take away from this, like even like the mentoring, like because it wasn't your mistake, it was someone in the team and you know they must

Like something that was really n really nice that Scott Caruthers in our previous episode said he was like, Yeah, you know, no one can beat you up. It's like you're someone that cares about your job, no one can beat you up about the mistake you've made more than yourself about this thing that you've done.

Ginny Marvin (17:22)
Yes. Yes.

Anu Adegbola (17:24)
so yeah, it'd be really great to, you know, get into the whole like how was this person helped through this process so that they didn't just sit in the mistake and, you know, blame themselves about it? Like

And and how did they develop in terms of like learning from this?

Ginny Marvin (17:42)
Yeah, I I heard Scott say that and I was like, my god, that is so true. yeah, so I think when you like for me, I knew that this person felt horrible. And so

Anu Adegbola (17:53)
Mm-hmm.

Ginny Marvin (17:53)
me saying anything from a blame standpoint or you should have or any of that in the moment, not helpful. Not

Anu Adegbola (18:03)
Mm, mm.

Ginny Marvin (18:03)
helpful at all. I think a lot of people in you know, doing that.

they'll shut down and

Anu Adegbola (18:09)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (18:10)
will not be able to, you know, think further ahead. Okay. We we're gonna need to get on this call. If you're thinking that you are this tiny and all is lost, that's not gonna be it's not gonna be helpful for the client. It's not gonna be helpful for your growth.

Anu Adegbola (18:29)
No.

Ginny Marvin (18:29)
and it's not gonna be helpful for me because

Anu Adegbola (18:32)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (18:33)
I have somebody who I know is highly talented, highly skilled, made a mistake. and so how can you give that the mistake the breadth it needs to settle while still

Anu Adegbola (18:45)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (18:46)
obviously addressing the the needs you need to address to move forward?

Anu Adegbola (18:51)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (18:52)
but don't address the like you did this wrong, how could you? No, that kind of thing. That needs space.

Anu Adegbola (18:58)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (18:59)
and that

needs space in coming back to, okay, we've gotten off the call with the client, we know our next steps with this client. Let's also set aside time to talk about our broader processes and

Anu Adegbola (19:12)
Mm, mm.

Ginny Marvin (19:13)
do a, you know, and and if you had the processes in place, I I thought we had decent processes, but there were clearly holes that we could address.

Anu Adegbola (19:20)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (19:22)
but you know, if there if there is a clearer set of processes.

And the you know, following through on them broke down at some point, you know, just sitting down and saying, Okay, let's let's just walk through what happened and what we can all learn going forward.

Anu Adegbola (19:38)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (19:39)
you know, obviously it's it's a different conversation if this is a habitual problem where somebody's

Anu Adegbola (19:43)
Yeah, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (19:45)
making mistakes. That's not the case. This person is like incredibly successful now. So that I think, you know, again, kind of the

put yourself in that person's shoes and how

Anu Adegbola (19:55)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (19:56)
would how would you best learn from this and what would you like to see from a mentor or boss or manager. So

Anu Adegbola (20:04)
Yeah, do that. So

as you're saying that I could almost like it's a weird thing that happens, like I could almost hear someone going going, Yeah, but Annie, we need to go through the process of you made a mistake. I mean, sure, we don't want to do it immediately. It's all about solving the problem that's that is important now. So when do you do that? When do I we do we sit down? Is it more of a you know

like performance review conversation that you has already planned or you know, do it early like or is it even not necessary depending?

Ginny Marvin (20:36)
Yeah, I g I guess it would also yes, it would depend on the situation on the person, how long have they been in the role, what kind of performance have they been you know, performing level have they been performing at? Is there something else going on in their life? you know, all of those things contribute to how you address the issue. And so you gotta be adaptive to

Anu Adegbola (21:01)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (21:01)
the situation in the person.

I do think not to wait, like don't wait for reviews. Like people should not be hearing about challenges and problems first at a performance review. But, you

Anu Adegbola (21:14)
Yeah, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (21:15)
know, I think that what I mean by giving it space, I just mean, you know, even if they I think Scott said this, go for a walk.

Anu Adegbola (21:23)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (21:26)
let them go for a walk, let them w have lunch, whatever it is.

and it may not even be the same day. It may be less we've addressed everything we can from the client's perspective, gotten everything

Anu Adegbola (21:38)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (21:38)
buttoned up, go home, get some rest, or you know, go out for dinner, whatever it is. And

Anu Adegbola (21:43)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (21:44)
we can we can chat about this in the morning and and set up some time. but you know, I think in a way that feels like the mission of this debrief,

Anu Adegbola (21:54)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (21:55)
or whatever you're gonna call it, is learning.

Anu Adegbola (21:57)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (21:57)
Learning and growth. That's the mission. It's not blame.

it's, you know, whether at at the individual level and and also at the team or organizational level as well. What are their learnings

Anu Adegbola (22:08)
Yeah, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (22:08)
there from?

Anu Adegbola (22:09)
Yeah. Yeah. Another point I like picking out from these kind of stories is what was surprising. Like 'cause sometimes you'll get people guessed have been like, you know, it was a client that we didn't have a great relationship with, and this mistake was like it just it would have made things worse, but they were actually a lot more chill than we thought that they would be, or even something internally, maybe a manager that, you know, felt that didn't really care, then really came in with you guys. Was there any something surprising that really

highlighted that things actually aren't the way that you thought they they should be and or are even is even better or might even highlight

Ginny Marvin (22:46)
Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (22:46)
that things are actually worse than what you thought they should be that this issue highlighted.

Ginny Marvin (22:53)
This issue highlighted for me, so this client, they were they were very they were always very skeptical.

Anu Adegbola (23:01)
Okay.

Ginny Marvin (23:02)
And so and not quite trusting. So

Anu Adegbola (23:05)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (23:05)
the the fact that this happened with their account was I mean sc like

Obviously we felt terrible and it was kind of scary. We were gonna have to get on this call and really try to bring them through this

Anu Adegbola (23:20)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (23:21)
this challenge, hopefully, and hopefully not

Anu Adegbola (23:22)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (23:24)
get fired. so I was surprised most in that in in that example where they listened really well. That was amazing. they they could have just got

got on the phone and just yelled. but they didn't.

Anu Adegbola (23:39)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (23:41)
And they said, okay, what happened? And, you know, we again, without over explaining, explained the very basic thing that happened that was wrong,

Anu Adegbola (23:51)
Mm, mm.

Ginny Marvin (23:52)
and took ownership of the mistake. And then I I think, and this wasn't, you know, not everyone's gonna react the same way, but I think because we were able to

Get on the phone right away. So we acknowledged the sense of urgency of the situation, took

Anu Adegbola (24:08)
Good.

Ginny Marvin (24:09)
responsibility, and then quickly pivoted to like, now let's solve it. and

Anu Adegbola (24:15)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (24:17)
and try to regain trust that way. You know, that it wouldn't work with every I mean, there's still still gonna be some clients that say, No, I'm out.

Anu Adegbola (24:28)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (24:29)
But also I found that sometimes, not always, the challenging clients are often can be the best clients.

Anu Adegbola (24:39)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (24:39)
And the easy clients can be just not not the best clients, I guess.

Anu Adegbola (24:45)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (24:46)
that's not to say I I mean challenging by they push you, right? They're pushing

Anu Adegbola (24:51)
They're pushing you. Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (24:54)
you.

And also those clients, they're I mean, when I say tough, and the best clients are also the ones that bring you to the table, bring the agency or the

or the the consultant to the table. I talk about this a lot. If you are working with an agency, working with a consultant, they are only gonna be as good as the information that they are have visibility into.

Anu Adegbola (25:21)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (25:21)
Especially now, right? Like

data is so important, so foundational to

Anu Adegbola (25:25)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (25:27)
success in for campaign success. But I'm thinking about things like obviously, you know, basics of we're changing our website and all our URLs are gonna change.

Anu Adegbola (25:37)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (25:37)
You know, I had that experience, right? Like,

Anu Adegbola (25:40)
god.

Ginny Marvin (25:41)
I'm sorry, everything for a Ford. We didn't tell you that we were launching a new website. Yeah, that's great.

Anu Adegbola (25:45)
Like, grey, why would

not

have any revenue? I wonder why. God, how nice.

Ginny Marvin (25:46)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

and also, you know, things like you know, what campaigns are they doing outside of paid search or paid media? W

Anu Adegbola (25:57)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (25:57)
if they have new if they have email campaigns, if they've got catalog drops, if they've got outdoor campaigns, all of that feeds back into

Anu Adegbola (26:03)
Yeah, even T V ads, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (26:06)
what is happening in your online campaigns. So those kinds of things. And and and then obviously things like

Our warehouse is not set up to be able to ship bundles. So we cannot try to advertise

Anu Adegbola (26:18)
Okay. So

Ginny Marvin (26:20)
bundles or, you know, create new SKUs in this way until, you know, we've got a six month outlay,

Anu Adegbola (26:27)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (26:28)
until we're ready to do that. So things like operationally, as well as what's happening in the broader marketing perspective for the client is really, really helpful to

Anu Adegbola (26:35)
Mm. Mm. Mm. Ready?

Ginny Marvin (26:39)
bring

Bring visibility to your agency consultants.

Anu Adegbola (26:43)
Yeah. I mean, I've said this

so many times. Even I'm bored of myself saying the fact that we should not work in silos. Guys, we should not work

Ginny Marvin (26:50)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Anu Adegbola (26:51)
in silos. I'm like, be really great at what you're doing with Paid Circ, but make sure that you know how SEO affects, TV affects, email make sure you know all these things. CRO especially as well has become a lot more important, you know, in the in the

Ginny Marvin (27:03)
Yes. Yes.

Anu Adegbola (27:04)
last few years. So, like, you know, you guys have really got to just be at least be aware. And so like even like at PPC Live events.

It will always out every once in a while like get someone who's like programmatic, an SEO person, someone just be like, Let them come and share to you so that you care that okay, what they're doing there will probably affect what PowerPate search runs. I'm like, Yeah. So yeah.

Ginny Marvin (27:24)
Yeah. Yeah.

And sometimes that means you're working across agencies, right? You've got multiple agencies doing each slice of the tactical pie and giving them insight into what the others are doing is also super helpful. And as

Anu Adegbola (27:38)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (27:39)
an agency or a consultant not being threatened by that work that's happening, that serves no one. Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (27:42)
Mm. Mm. Yeah. Yeah. No. No, not

at all. Okay. Okay. So, like, one other question I like asking is like let's say someone is in this position of like, yeah, they've got an international archive, they've woken up to a mistake has happened, they, you know, they they they're a a a an email has come through saying we need to talk now, and you know what the mistake is, and they're a bit scared. What's your advice to them?

Ginny Marvin (28:11)
to make sure you take a breath. Like don't just hop on the call.

Anu Adegbola (28:17)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (28:20)
regroup with the team.

Anu Adegbola (28:22)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (28:22)
Get an understanding of what the situation really is. Do as much preliminary digging as you can so that you're not hopping on a call blind and

Anu Adegbola (28:33)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (28:34)
you're able to come with a

understanding of what went wrong and

Anu Adegbola (28:39)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (28:40)
hopefully start to be able to pivot the conversation around here's what you know towards a solution oriented discussion. That's

Anu Adegbola (28:47)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (28:50)
that would be my recommendation. The while still conveying a sense of urgency, right? Like and sometimes

Anu Adegbola (28:56)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (28:58)
sometimes you will quickly know, I know exactly what happened and I yes I can get on a call with you right now.

Anu Adegbola (29:01)
Yeah. Like what rank

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (29:05)
so

but yeah, if you know, and if it's a and also I would say I mean, I I hope this goes without saying, but

Anu Adegbola (29:14)
Hmm.

Ginny Marvin (29:15)
the you don't blame the junior person who

made the mistake, right? You take ownership. So

Anu Adegbola (29:21)
You'd be

surprised how that actually does still need to be said. I'd be sad to hear that sometimes

Ginny Marvin (29:25)
Yeah. I know.

Anu Adegbola (29:26)
people still need to hear that. Guys, like some managers, some heads up still need to hear that. Like the blame culture that I've seen in some agencies have been like, gosh, really guys are still doing this? yeah.

Ginny Marvin (29:38)
I know.

Yeah, it's yeah, that does not reflect well on you. You can say yes, this person made the mistake. We take full responsibility,

Anu Adegbola (29:50)
Right.

Ginny Marvin (29:51)
right? But like the it is not it doesn't not reflect well on you to the client, I promise you. as

Anu Adegbola (29:57)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (29:58)
also having been in house to

Anu Adegbola (30:00)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (30:01)
to hear that. It's

Anu Adegbola (30:02)
Yeah, yeah,

that's an interesting yeah, viewpoint of that of that. The client hearing that is not thinking well of you because you've just said, this is the person that did it, and you know, throw someone else. So because if you're willing to throw someone on the bus under the bus, you're you're willing to do that of anyone, and that could be them one day. And you know, yeah,

Ginny Marvin (30:20)
Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (30:21)
yeah, I totally get that point of view. We are going to go to which I'm sure our our listeners are just eagerly waiting for you to give your thoughts in the industry as a in general, but

I just like to to you to just give like, you know, like a one sentence, what's one big takeaway that you want people to take from just that story you've shared? And even if if if they were distracted by other things, what's what like the big headline of that story?

Ginny Marvin (30:47)
Hmm, I I guess it would be gosh. I mean, there's so many. Like processes matter

Anu Adegbola (30:53)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (30:55)
and taking responsibility matters. And the

Anu Adegbola (30:57)
Yeah, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (30:59)
big takeaway is learning from mistakes. Hopefully, right?

Anu Adegbola (31:02)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (31:03)
Like hopefully you learn from your mistakes as best you can. And we all make them. And we all make them. Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (31:06)
Yeah. As best you can. Fantastic. Yeah. Absolutely.

Absolutely. All right. Going to yeah, your your many years of experience of seeing what people are sharing about what they're doing, experiencing, how they're experiencing the Google Ads updates, not even how they're experiencing the updates itself, how they're experiencing

Announcements of updates that are coming up. There's like one of the biggest one this month that is coming up is August 17, where smart bidding is or could be changing. And in but in the more in the spirit of because I know you've given a lot of insights about it. You shared a video recently about, you know, doing a QA as to what should come. So it's not about repeating yourself in that area, but it's more about what where do you think people are going wrong in how they're approaching?

this? What's the mistake people are making in terms of like that that you know a loophole that they've just gone, that's that's not the right way to see what we've just announced. You know, what what's the mistake people are making in terms of how they're approaching this?

No.

Ginny Marvin (32:11)
Yeah, and this is certainly not universal.

and it's not it's not even isolated to this update. But

Anu Adegbola (32:17)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (32:17)
the I I it all kind of goes back to like the f un understanding the fundamentals understanding the fundamentals still really matters.

Anu Adegbola (32:25)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (32:26)
and it is very easy to take a a knee-jerk reaction and not saying that the again, not saying this is universal.

Anu Adegbola (32:33)
Not everybody.

Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (32:34)
to

to changes, right? And I I've been guilty of this too and or just assumed this is a bad change.

Anu Adegbola (32:41)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (32:42)
and then what I think is important is understand, okay, what does the what's actually changing and what how does that actually affect my current implementation, my current strategy, and way that

I've set my in this case targets. So in and also it's always good feedback of like how can we communicate better? I'll tell you, being on this side, it's often very complex. to you want to be very precise in your wording.

Anu Adegbola (33:15)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (33:16)
and then that can can sound jargony and

actually make it kind of harder to explain.

Anu Adegbola (33:22)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (33:23)
But so taking this this August 17th update, for one, it only it's only impacting campaigns that are limited by budget and

Anu Adegbola (33:34)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (33:35)
overachieving on the target that you've set in the campaign. This has the campaigns that are not restricted by budget already work this way. So right there, and I know a t I I know a lot of

people operate with constricted budgets. We do always say if you're if you are going to, if you're using smart bidding and you're going to use a target, we like always recommended not having capped or constrained budgets and using or if you don't know your target and you have a fixed budget, use max conversions, max conversion value without a target. So that though those are still your option. If you have a very set

budget you can use those bid strategies. and so I think you know the the the going back to the fundamentals so basically what this is doing is just kind of unifying how targets are used by the system and aligning

Anu Adegbola (34:31)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (34:32)
the your targets to the bids. So you should like

Our recommendation is if you are if you have campaigns that are limited by budget and overachieving on their target, look at your current average target performance, look at your full

Anu Adegbola (34:47)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (34:49)
conversion cycle and

Anu Adegbola (34:51)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (34:51)
adjust the target if you want to keep achieving that average performance. If you

Anu Adegbola (34:57)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (34:59)
don't and you wanna keep your

target, you can expect to likely be in entering different auctions. And that

Anu Adegbola (35:08)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (35:09)
can obviously change your your your bids and CPCs.

Anu Adegbola (35:13)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (35:14)
And but I think really the key is thinking about your your target is your efficiency lever. And

Anu Adegbola (35:22)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (35:23)
when when if you're budget constrained, that is your efficiency lever. So if you want

you know, more conversion volume at

Anu Adegbola (35:32)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (35:32)
a lower CPA. You

Anu Adegbola (35:35)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (35:36)
then lower the CPA. I I guess so is that does that make sense? So you're

Anu Adegbola (35:38)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (35:42)
you're you're thinking about your target in terms of your like directly towards your business goals.

Anu Adegbola (35:48)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (35:49)
And your target will more closely align with your bid now in budget constrained campaigns when you're using a target.

Anu Adegbola (35:56)
Yeah.

Yeah. You you think that well hopefully that most advertisers are aware that their targets should be aligned with the business goals. But it's you know, people people I I think that's something that I another previous you know, guest has said that yeah, a big learning for her from a mistake that she made was like we really need to even what we test, the different things that are coming out.

It's about the business goals because we might think, okay, it makes sense to let's say change the account structure for us, because you know, we know, like, well, you know, this is what the website looks like. But then if that means there's going to be a drop in revenue for a couple of weeks where where the business cannot afford to have a drop in revenue, you know, you've not matched what you're trying you're trying to test effectively according to business goals. And then so therefore you're wrong, even though technically that's best practice. So

Doing things according to what the what will make sense for the business is should always be paramount, is what I've really been been hearing from from other guests too.

Ginny Marvin (36:59)
Yeah. Yeah. I for absolutely. And again, this is where like having that seat at the table to understand what the client's goals are, what their you know, if it's if there's promotions going on, obviously, inventory levels, all of those kinds of things. What are the margins on the products? The margins changing on the products. all all of those factors go into the bidding strategies that you're setting. So

but I think the the main thing is you know what else I would say? And this is gonna sound strange.

Anu Adegbola (37:28)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (37:30)
but to read help center articles. I know I I know there are challenges when sometimes things are not updated as po as much as possible, but

Anu Adegbola (37:38)
There's a lot, yeah. There's a lot of though.

Ginny Marvin (37:41)
yeah, but there's also a lot of information in those pages

Anu Adegbola (37:45)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (37:46)
that

is r some some real gems in there in terms of like just f basics of how things work.

Anu Adegbola (37:53)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (37:54)
and I I remember being at Search Engine Land and writing a story and saying, I d I don't know if Google said has Google ever even talked about this? And

Anu Adegbola (38:03)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (38:04)
it's in the Help Center article that

Anu Adegbola (38:05)
Mm-hmm.

Ginny Marvin (38:06)
I thought I was familiar with, but I d

Anu Adegbola (38:08)
Yeah, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (38:08)
Yes, I didn't read.

and and that is not to say you know, you need to spend hours in the help center articles, but there there are if you if you're thinking,

Anu Adegbola (38:16)
Adams.

Ginny Marvin (38:17)
do I really understand how that works? Like that you may find some

Anu Adegbola (38:22)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (38:22)
helpful information in there. So in term like

Anu Adegbola (38:25)
Absolutely.

Ginny Marvin (38:26)
the s the bidding pages can be very helpful as well.

Anu Adegbola (38:30)
Nice. Yeah. I mean, right now I I imagine that a lot of people probably should do that as homework before before August seventeenth so that they it really gets get an idea of what's gonna change for them. 'Cause for 'cause

Ginny Marvin (38:43)
Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (38:43)
I I imagine for a lot of people nothing will change even because they are doing their jobs well, they know their targets, they know what the business goals are, they imagine that. And yeah, so yeah, it'll be interesting to see.

Ginny Marvin (38:55)
Sometimes

it's good s sometimes it can just be a good also there are yeah, it they can just sort of be a good refresher to take a peek.

Anu Adegbola (39:03)
Yeah, absolutely.

Okay, and then going into also now talking about like let's say mistakes that you know you see people people using in terms of approaching mistakes people make in terms of how they approach, let's say, AI implementations, 'cause yeah, I've been big in terms of loads of updat updates in the past, you know, a couple of years now. how people are approaching it that you think that's not how you should use it in terms of let's say even things like, you know,

ask

advice and the the new ways of engaging with the platform to maybe like give you ideas or optimizations to to apply to your accounts how are ways that you've seen people have said that they've used it that way they've not liked the outcome and you've you'll and you can point to like well that's not how it should have been used. Are there any examples that come to mind about like kind of things like that?

Ginny Marvin (39:54)
Yeah, I mean I think if you take Ask Advisor, that's obviously a a newer product. We

Anu Adegbola (39:59)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (40:00)
all know these things need time to learn and evolve. and so keeping the feedback coming, super helpful.

Anu Adegbola (40:08)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (40:09)
but you know, expecting i it's not gonna be a hundred percent accurate, which I think we

Anu Adegbola (40:15)
Yeah. According.

Ginny Marvin (40:17)
try to make clear. But

But I you know, I think those are the kinds of things that, you know, understanding how AI models work, they get better with time.

and feedback really, really helps. So that's

Anu Adegbola (40:29)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (40:29)
I would keep that in mind. and then I guess in terms of how people are using new features, I d I I wouldn't say I see anything new

Anu Adegbola (40:38)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (40:39)
in you know, specifically around

new campaign types or new features. I

Anu Adegbola (40:44)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (40:45)
think it's it's still the things have always been evolving and seemingly evolving very rapidly in this space, right? I I it's always feels like things are changing. And

Anu Adegbola (40:56)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (40:56)
and part of the reason why I was interested in this role is be we were at this sort of pivotal time of automation.

Back, that's what we called it then. and and privacy changes, like there were so much of kind of fundamentally shifting that trying to help folks navigate that and help bring that feedback in, I thought could be helpful. and so now I think the real difference is that pace of change in terms of how the

models in many of the stuff is like a lot of the stuff is just back-end improvements.

Anu Adegbola (41:33)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (41:34)
So the old the old saying of if you tried something once and it didn't work, try it again, I think is even more relevant now,

Anu Adegbola (41:43)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (41:44)
again, because of the pace

Anu Adegbola (41:47)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (41:48)
of change and pace of back end improvements. and again, still the fundamentals of like

What are we trying to test? What

Anu Adegbola (41:55)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (41:55)
are the metrics that are going to indicate if this is working positively?

Anu Adegbola (42:01)
Hmm.

Ginny Marvin (42:02)
if you are trying to increase your your value, your conversion value,

Anu Adegbola (42:09)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (42:10)
then CPCs are probably not the metric you're gonna want to look at, right? Like

What are the business outcomes? Go going back to the business outcomes, like looking at the metrics that are really indicating the the change in value, volume, business

Anu Adegbola (42:25)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (42:26)
outcomes for the business, I think is still just like should be your your North Star.

Anu Adegbola (42:32)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (42:33)
And then yeah, I think obviously.

Things improve with time.

Anu Adegbola (42:39)
Mm.

Ginny Marvin (42:40)
If you're going to be testing things, like as as much as you can have a test budget, I

Anu Adegbola (42:45)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (42:45)
think that is an a testing ethos and testing

Anu Adegbola (42:49)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (42:49)
mindset and setting expectations with stakeholders, clients. That's really the way to sort of be ahead of the curve and ready for what's whatever is next.

Anu Adegbola (43:04)
Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And mentioning whatever is next, is any can you give us any insight into what people should be expecting like next in the like next like six months or twelve months of what Google is testing?

Or even like the

Ginny Marvin (43:21)
I think

Anu Adegbola (43:21)
types of odd updates that we should expect, maybe.

Ginny Marvin (43:24)
Yeah. So some of the things at at GML that were announced are going to s be still rolling out.

Anu Adegbola (43:32)
Still coming. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (43:33)
Yep. So I would look at those announcements. I think you know, broadly speaking, you know, when I talked to Vidya Srinanasan, who is our the head of ads and commerce at Google,

Anu Adegbola (43:46)
Yeah, that's yeah.

Ginny Marvin (43:48)
when I I spoke with her

at GML. And I think, you know, she said, this is the the path that we're on. We are moving, we're bought in, we are moving ahead. and so that to me is a clear signal of how do I get my teams and our how do I have my con the conversations I'm having with my clients of let's start

planning. Like if we're not

Anu Adegbola (44:15)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (44:17)
testing the waters now, how what is that gonna how can we get there? How can we look?

Anu Adegbola (44:22)
Mm, mm.

Ginny Marvin (44:23)
obviously like crystal ball, but you know, if that if that's what's been said, we

Anu Adegbola (44:31)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (44:31)
can s we can see what's been happening in the last two years or so.

Anu Adegbola (44:34)
Yeah. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (44:36)
and how can we best set ourselves up for success?

Anu Adegbola (44:41)
Yeah, absolutely. Look, I can't think of a better note to to you know to leave you on. Like, thank you, Jeannie. You have given us so much, so many insights and being generous with your time here. You're so generous with your time and your answers with us. So whether it's on Twitter or LinkedIn or Slack groups and different Slacks. We're so really, really grateful for that. Thank you so much, Jeannie. It's been an amazing conversation.

Ginny Marvin (45:05)
You're welcome. Well, I hopefully I I try to answer them the way I would want to be answered to. So if w when I fall

Anu Adegbola (45:10)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (45:11)
short, please let me know.

Anu Adegbola (45:12)
Yeah, yeah, we we do. A lot of people do. Right.

Ginny Marvin (45:14)
Yeah. Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (45:15)
I'm like, guys, you just need to be a bit patient sometimes is what I s what I think with a lot of people. but before before

Ginny Marvin (45:19)
Yeah. It's all right. Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (45:22)
we wrap up, a nice fun question that you know is not about PVC really at all. if your PVC career were a movie, what would the title be?

Ginny Marvin (45:32)
Okay, and this is a made up title, right? Not let okay.

Anu Adegbola (45:34)
Yeah, it can be. Yeah. Of course.

Ginny Marvin (45:36)
I think it would be something like The Crooked Sidewalk. I've not had a linear career in any way, shape, or form. but always sort of stayed on

Anu Adegbola (45:39)
Okay, interesting. Why? No, no. Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (45:48)
the same directional path in terms of working in in digital advertising.

Anu Adegbola (45:51)
in the industry.

Ginny Marvin (45:53)
But

Anu Adegbola (45:53)
No, amazing. I r I really found it very interesting, like, you know, in that yeah, in the conversation that we had about, you know, Search Engine Land turning twenty that, you know, working for Google was never necessarily like a dream job or dream company at some point. It's just something that came, the offer came at the right time and you know, right stage in your life and yeah, you you went with it. No.

Ginny Marvin (46:14)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. No, it was not I was, I I think I said I was gonna keep doing some consulting, working on a

Anu Adegbola (46:21)
Yeah.

Ginny Marvin (46:22)
project. and yeah, so yeah, you never know what's gonna come around the band.

Anu Adegbola (46:27)
Yeah,

never know. I just hope n no no one in industry has made you regret that decision with all the with all the banging on your doors to all the questions that we asked. I hope there's not been any moment going, god, why did I do this? Because I I love even the

Ginny Marvin (46:40)
No

Anu Adegbola (46:41)
way that sometimes you'll t you'll tell us guys I'm on holiday. So you know, just like you have to tell us that

Ginny Marvin (46:45)
I

Anu Adegbola (46:46)
you're on holiday is just so funny. bless.

Ginny Marvin (46:48)
I know. Well, yeah, I did I started doing that. I just thought it'd be helpful 'cause it there's nothing worse than I mean a and I know I do miss some questions in here and there. So don't ever hesitate to ping me again. But yeah.

Anu Adegbola (47:02)
Yeah.

I mean you're one person, you know, it's like, yeah,

Ginny Marvin (47:05)
Yes.

Anu Adegbola (47:05)
of course you're gonna miss. And sometimes the algorithm, LinkedIn and Twitter, they're not they're not always perfect in terms of showing you what the notes you want to see. So yeah, it's just keep that in mind. but yeah, thank you so much. I mean, I usually ask people where people can find you. I know you're very prevalent. I'm very vocal on LinkedIn, on Twitter, X, and any other platforms that or like on YouTube, you you you share videos and you know, they're there's there of the stuff. But any

other like you know, areas that we should be aware that maybe people are not too aware that you you show up as well.

Ginny Marvin (47:36)
yeah, so last year we started the Ads Decoded podcast, which is on on YouTube, on the Google Ads channel. And I'm a little bit on threads. I try to remember

Anu Adegbola (47:46)
Okay. Right, yeah.

Ginny Marvin (47:48)
threads. and and then I'm in some of the the Slack groups, so Paid Search Association and PVC chat and yeah, so yeah.

Anu Adegbola (47:53)
Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Amazing.

So many areas. So many areas that you give us your time and attention. So really, really love that. Well, on that note, Jimmy, thank you so much. That's been a an amazing conversation and I'm sure our listeners have found that extremely useful. And yeah, I'm sure we'll catch up soon. What what's like the next event for you actually? 'Cause yeah, that's another thing I like to ask. P P C Live is all about events. Are you are you gonna be

Ginny Marvin (48:20)
Yeah.

Anu Adegbola (48:21)
Maybe in the U in Europe or more in the US.

Ginny Marvin (48:24)
Yeah, so I I have not been able to do much travel lately, but I will be going to SMX Berlin at the end of September. So I will hopefully see a lot

Anu Adegbola (48:34)
amazing! See you there.

Ginny Marvin (48:36)
of my Amia friends over there. Yes. So

Anu Adegbola (48:39)
we're excited for that. We'll be so excited for that. So,

Ginny Marvin (48:41)
Good.

Anu Adegbola (48:41)
yeah, that's like end of September. so yeah, I think it's like yeah, September 10 to 9th to October 1st. that's fantastic. looking forward to that. Well, yeah, definitely

Ginny Marvin (48:49)
Yes.

Anu Adegbola (48:50)
we'll catch up then. but yeah, for now, thank you so much, Ginny, for your time. And yeah, we'll see you on the social very soon, I'm sure. Bye.

Ginny Marvin (48:57)
Thanks, Anu. Thanks for the walk down memory lane. It was fun.

Anu Adegbola (49:01)
Amazing, thanks.

Ginny Marvin (49:02)
Okay.

Anu Adegbola (49:04)
Thank you so much, Ginny, for sharing that that very like, you know, personal, your own personal experience in the industry and how you yeah, you you pick back up from that mistake that happened. And those very in you know, insightful insights as to what to do, you know, the things to do next. And also looking at, you know, being able to answer some questions as to our industry on how we approach Google and whether and Google and their Google updates and the way we do that is not quite right.

Especially with our August seventeenth update coming next week. So that's what yeah, but from when people will be listening to this, this will be happening in about a week, I imagine. Or if you're listening to this after August seventeenth, yeah, you're probably going, Whoa, after all that hoopla and all that things that, you know, people made it it probably wasn't that big a deal or an update, or you're thinking, yeah, it was a big deal, or you're like just grateful what for what Ginny has has has told you and you're you agree with her. Or maybe you don't. Let us know. Yeah, share it on LinkedIn, share us.

Shout in my DMs. but yeah, I think it's just always good to remember that the basics, the basic and the structural fundamentals of how digital marketing works, that it's about your customer, what they want to see, how they're gonna see your ads, and ensuring that it communicates directly what your product is, that's never going to change. So a lot of the ways of how you know monitoring and being able to see your ads is your ads is going to change. And that is what why paid surge marketers will always be needed. I think sometimes people used to say that.

Google is trying to push out the paid search marketer. But as much as there's going to be all these new ways of and and sometimes confusing ways of how to implement the paid search campaign, that's where a paid search marketer, a paid search marketer's role is still going to be fundamental and critical for a lot of companies, even if even from SMBs all the way to, you know, the big enterprise companies. So yeah, for all the full information and the full transcripts, not just the show notes, please go to podcast.pc.

Also check out the article we wrote about getting advice about all from all the folks, you know, from like about over 20 folks, like several folks who have done gone through all these industry changes. They give advice on how to prepare for the August 17th update. So just go to our PPC.live page onto our blog and you'll see the article that's been put together for that. yeah, and before I leave you, I'm also delighted to share that I am taking on coaching clients.

so yeah, if you go to the marketingandu.com, yeah, you'll be able to see the different aspects of where how I can help you in terms of whether it's about you know building up your confidence or just just trying to figure out how to go for that promotion or or or whatever it is. Like if you just even want to see the review, someone send me a copy of that. Get in touch with me. go to the marketingandu.com. We'll be able to do a 15-minute free discovery call.

and to figure out what it is exactly that you need help with. So yeah, I hope you've enjoyed the show and I look forward to bringing more PPC F ups and charms next week. Thank you.