EP245 - Wrangling Google Ads Performance Max

0:00 Hello, and welcome to this week's episode of the PPC chat Roundup in today's episode. We have Julie being joined by another awesome member of our community management. Annie and me has positioned himself brilliantly as an expert on performance. Max releasing articles on search engine land, especially about updates the way to uses things that you should watch out for ways to add - to Performance Max campaign. So, unsurprisingly, today's topic is going to be about wrangling, Google ads, performance, Max. Now, when I saw that, It'll I thought to myself, if we have to identify it as Google ads, performance Max, does that mean they'll be a big performance? Max will there be possibly a tick? Tock performance, Max laptop for campaign?

0:41 Because yeah, Tick-Tock, I'm going to be joining the paid search corner of advertising. So yeah, that's very interesting. But let's not tangent of too much. Today we're going to be talking about wrangling Google ads, performance, Max hope you enjoy. Hello and a warm, welcome to this week's episode of the PPC chat around up a podcast where I round up the Twitter discussion. That happens on Tuesdays at 5 p.m. GMT. I'm your host annual and I'm recording from my studio here in London UK. And I use this platform to share, not just expert but also my ideas and considered best practices about paid media and the direction of the digital industry is going in.

1:23 So if you want to keep up to date, Date with my tips and tricks in the industry and get the latest on the podcast that has been called your go-to if you don't make it to the PBC, check live discussions and even if you do then like follow share and retweets on. That's right. Twitter with my handle the marketing, a new or follow me on LinkedIn. Just find my name a new addict, Bola or just search for the marketing. A new. I put all my posts with that hashtag. So I'm sure you'll find me and my post when you search for that. There's also PPC chat Round Up in a podcast group on LinkedIn as well as on Instagram, if you The see some of our courts and Snippets from our previous episodes. Why don't you check us out at PPC, chat underscore Roundup. So today we have Judy joined by manatee, Manatee, talking about wrangling, Google ads. A performance Max is going to be a long conversation, so I'm not going to do too much of a role called safe to say. A lot of people join likes of Melissa. Why not web?

2:14 And Julia brought is chilly advice. Yes, itself and so Feel, Again, Kirk Williams, gildner Boris. Becker, like I said, I want to do a roll call and now I'm doing one. Let's get into what Julie talk. Us about before we do get into the questions though, she always likes to say, which is very important is that this chat is intended for PPC, Professionals of all levels. If you have something you want to share, please do we are a friendly and supportive Community, please don't be afraid to participate. Lurkers are of course always welcome to. So yeah, I'll get right into the questions because there are lots of them loads of answers. The first question already got 14 replies to it. So yeah, say a prayer for me to make sure that I keep up on. Give you all the juicy details question.

2:54 Is asked, are you currently running performance Max campaigns in Google ads? If so for how long and for what industry or product Kirk Williams jumps right in there saying yes, we run a hybrid of both P Max and standard in most of our e-commerce accounts and have since they murdered smart shopping. We don't run pmags at all in our lead. Gen accounts. American goes. We take a similar approach. I'm Miss smart shopping management. Also responds, same as mentioned. We've been running performance Max, since it was in beta in late 2021. And it's been amazing to watch the product evolve with used it across multiple Industries, for many clients, B2B and b2c excetera Diana. Lena respond saying yes, since it was in beta, I think summer of 2021, I'm editing goes crazy. How much it's changed?

3:40 Sophia response saying yes, but only for e-commerce clients curious to hear how they perform for lead-gen, once it doesn't sound a lot of people are using it for lead gen but managing reply saying lead gen is tough because you'll get lots of spam. If you cannot import offline data, As the lead progresses through the pipeline. See here and he shares a link to a previous article, he shared PPC, Cindy response saying, not running P Max but might test specific product line soon, but with stripped Assets in house manager, large Niche, apparel or home retailer, 16 years still doing standard shopping with success. We need targeting or control. Not wider reach. No black boxes. I'm a legend goes. I'd recommend trying smart shopping style. Pmax also might be worth looking at At social style. If you see success on paid social, he also shares a search engine land article that he wrote. As in why Facebook advertisers should test performance Max via manage him Annie.

4:35 So go look for that on search engine land. Just look for why Facebook advertisers should test performance. Max mizzle response saying yes, at least a year, maybe more e-comm clients mostly, however, recently, not really running them as Google would like you're gonna respond saying, yes, we're running. Pmax for Is fine since the very beginning where heavily in e-comm Texas, imagine goes, are these all campaigns with conversion values being reported, and girl responds to that same. Every single one, I can't think of an exception Kaleb Williams response am still trying to figure out how to effectively get it to work for e-comm one client, it runs smooth as a cat others.

5:16 It's hard to reach the right customers and get a sale. Had some segments acid groups, While others avoid completely manager, In response to that thing. I'd recommend reviewing the product data feeds of product titles, taxonomy, identifiers Etc. And yes, he also shares a link talking about that. From August, 20, 22, Caleb response. A data feed watch is definitely helpful for those who don't use another software. So yeah, datafeed watch is a good one. Good shoutouts to manage your feed, CB response, a my work for a competing platform. Catering to e-comm DTC clients and I'd say about half of them are also Running P Max. I listened respectfully. And saying we are running for higher ed and Home Services.

5:56 We tried it early on but it was too expensive and now we use it with much better results. Since Google has made updated to it. Alex Response Team being pmax sin, since it was betta, we tested all accounts and run constantly immersed for major buckets e-comm. B2c lead gen B2B Legion info, products and coaching Alfred Simon response. Yes, and 2021 early adopter. And for all kinds of clients lead gen e-commerce and recruitment. Bugs response saying yes, and from form submissions and phone calls on b2c Services have seen 50% Louis CPA compared to search campaigns getting quality leads to not sure what all the fuss is about. People getting low quality needs.

6:38 We also have Melissa McKee responding to a nope, not enough brand safety. For most of our B2B clients not enough controls Julie respond saying I'm not currently running any performance Max campaigns but I am very interested in hearing from those who are and taking notes. So if you're looking Same here, I read everything. I can get my hands on about it, especially experiences from a lead gen perspective just waiting for my time to get stuck in. I just want one of her clients to give her a chance. I'm sure. And she does give her response as well. Saying I'm not running. Pmax campaigns yet industry. Primarily B2B lead generation clients. Mannequin goes, what are some of the concerns that holds you back from testing. So if you're looking goes yeah my clients don't like spending any money on things which aren't guaranteed to work. Lord nothing.

7:24 Is guaranteed to work, everything is. It depends. You need to test some things will work. Some things weren't and you keep running until you get that perfect space. When if you do more, you're going to get to a point of diminishing return anyway, I hope they give her short soon so they are only willing to spend on things we generate consistent leads, unfortunately this applies to trying various different things not just max she continues. The main issue is that the learning optimization period is not something. They will accept one week of low leads for their And it campaigns is enough to cause chaos. Wow. Frustrations who work around by understand. They need to keep a consistent stream of sales. Ready leads feeding through to their sales, team who will complain about lack of leads which then causes internal issues and so on.

8:08 And so, on managing goes all yes, often times. People forget there is a sales team or cash flow issues to consider so if he goes exactly there's always someone else to answer to. Yeah those leads are coming in and it was good or bad quality leads that are coming in. They're going to Ooh, Somebody Julie advice response saying yes under duress Google folks, my locals to change over to P Max. So I'm running quite a bit. Just now, managing goes, I don't have much experience with local campaigns. I'm assuming performance is not as good in performance. Max Julia Barnes goes. Yes, the overall performance is comparable, but if your goal is store visits the old no longer available locals products, was more efficient and had higher volume. And then we have Boris responding to question once a mostly e-comm tried.

8:54 Jen, when it was still new and got burned. My chain response him, I'd encourage you to try it again. With offline, conversion, data bars goes. Yep. Didn't know what? I didn't know back then. So yeah I hope he knows better and tests more with them now. And yeah after those the scary of answers or will give Mike's answers first before we go to question, two. Mike answers question one saying yes we run pmax campaigns for lots of online retailers and some Brands since the early days, but it took a few months until Option got serious. Julie then goes on to question. 2, saying, how would you characterize your experience with performance mods? For the account, you manage the Safar manage. Him goes, it's always challenging, learning new techniques by Embrace change and I enjoy the challenge. So much has changed over the years, my approaches to jump in headfirst and learn quickly.

9:43 Lawrence respond saying, this is the way very Mandalorian, if the platform releases something, this big it is always best to learn it and find ways to make it work because this The way they wanted to go Dinah response. Team at the beginning, we weren't really satisfied with the results and even thought about giving up on it, but after lots of testing and experimenting, we found the sweet spot for our campaigns and now we are really satisfied with what it brings so P. Max is working for people. Here we go Kirk Williams response thing when it has enough conversion data or traffic Etc. P Max often does what it's supposed to do? Get sales at your target row as within your budget parameters, that being said measuring, Incrementality and impact on other channels, is more tricky. Casey stump response saying, how do you decide on rollers? Target for p.

10:31 Max seems like the target needs to be higher than a normal cold acquisition Channel but may be lower than the normal retargeting campaign, considering its a mix of both. Do you have to just use incrementality testing to figure it out Colin's? Respond saying, we typically aim for a row as we would be happy at as a blended row, as since this is both non brand and brand traffic. And then we adjust from there as actual campaign performance reveals itself and as we get an idea of what the mix is in the campaign. My opinion, it's not an exact science. None of this is he continues. I wrote this short thread two weeks ago, I think. Untrained incrementality question is pretty important and it's not actually driving more sales cross-channel than previously should be reverted due to data loss in P Max.

11:17 And he shares something about that and Julie is going to add that thread to the recap post. So make sure you go to official PPC At to get that thread, we have Gilman responding to question to say in general, I'd say I am a p Max fan. It took a while for p Max to hit its stride but we learned how to structure it, appropriately, it does not always work when it doesn't, it doesn't. But with some patience and attention, it's pretty solid especially for e-comm manage and respond saying. This is very true in my experience as well. It does not work in every scenario. They are times where it struggles and you're better off with standard search or shopping. So fear. It's the typical. It depends. There are some accounts that P Max does wonders and others that struggle, making it work. Mizzle respond saying I've seen mixed performance, so it's kept me on my toes.

12:05 The script to show which channels are doing, what has really supported, how I run them, Casey stamp response, a most of my experience is trying pmax with lead gen. Couldn't figure out a way to avoid. Spam need to revisit it as it's been a couple of months. I'm managing girls hair, two threads, I don't improve the lead. Quality, Alfred Simon respond saying, it depends on a lot of things. I had extremely good and also really bad experiences but the majority's, okay, I'm curious what the future brings and what kinds of updates we will get and a very interesting thread from question. One started off here, Gilman had responded saying, yes, we're running P Max for most clients since the very beginning James, Greg response to that saying, which sasses wouldn't you run pmax with most of mine are too Niche. Is still or we run pmags with a very limited. A girl responds saying, most of our SAS clients have pretty healthy budget.

12:58 So we always test even if it's just a small supplemental. Pmax campaign apps recruitment security me shoes for these clients. And James goes, yes, that makes sense. You wouldn't be doing their budget, a service. If you weren't testing these newer methods in Google ads and then we have Dwayne Brown responding to question 2. Saying the i p. Max is like going to the circle or to the circus. You don't always know what is going to happen. It's Where the product is getting updated and better in my opinion, overall still needs work managing response to that saying, I'm sure that P Max will look very different in 12 months from now, Dwayne Brown response saying, I'm sure it's will to still waiting to see when we get that asset audience report to Google mentioned last year unless it came out and I missed it. And he tags Ginny Marvin in that medicine goes. I'm most excited about that.

13:49 Out of all the new features and nest and then we have Julia Viceroy. Audience question to sing fine question, mark, it took a bit to deal with acid groups, versus ad groups on the lack of audiences negatives, or any kind of anything you can do other than creative, very easy to set up. But no, real optimizations, at least as far as I can see, managing goes, I wish that we can navigate acid groups from the left navigation. And yeah, he mentioned how he alerted Ginny Moffitt to that. John Keegan goes. I'll sum it up in one gift and it's a dog in the middle of an office with the fire. Flaming everywhere. I'm sure. You know what? Which one I'm talking about there. Boris response to question, two saying, I like it but it's difficult sometimes to get used to depends on the account and how well optimized existing campaigns are Julie.

14:37 Then goes on to question 3 saying have you tried pmax for e-commerce or and or lead gen? Did you find it performed differently between e commonly Jen. If so how many him go Sara? We've done both e-commerce is much easier because the system already has the revenue and can Target. That will likely convert with lead gen. The trick is getting quality. Leads the only way to accomplish. This is to connect your CRM data to Google ads. And yet he continues in has a thread. I put together on how. And again I do these on add that to the recap post Diana response to question 3 saying, I only tested it for lead gen as I don't, I didn't have any customer in the ecomp sector. They'll respond saying we're all in on e-commerce. So yes, it works.

15:20 Fantastically at first P. Max didn't do so great with Legion. But being seen to get a little better, it works when you have lots of conversion goals, set up, sometimes difficult to do well with lead gen. Alfred Simon Response Team tried for both e-comm is easier. But lead-gen can work extremely well, when we used offline conversion data and value-based bidding, some accounts went to the moon. E-commerce is more about product management, making sure that every product gets a chance. Alex mycoskie response saying have Using it for both clean signal is key to making it work. E-commerce is a slam-dunk because Bots don't have credit cards.

16:02 So revenue, is that signal and Lead gen. You build feedback, looks and heuristics to DQ junk leads and not fire conversion actions on that. And when Boris responded to question 2, he said that it's like, it depends on the account and how well the optimized existing campaigns are again depends on the account and how well optimized existing. Pains are gill response to that same second, this, it has always performed really well for us when paired with a healthy account history, great product feed and lots and lots of data. This is a key point that Google likes to gloss over performance Max. Like all of their automated campaigns needs a large Baseline of data, Melissa respond saying, yes, and this is another issue in B2B where lead volume is often quite low.

16:47 Barely enough data for smart bidding. Much less something like P Max and my cry on his response to And to sing for many. It feels like an uneasy truce as sellout moment in that, they're not necessarily comfortable with the technology, but the in platform numbers are typically solid. So what are you going to do? No one is Overjoyed where they acceptance. Level is high. Yeah, we've got Gil. Responding to that saying, when it works well, most CMOS embrace it once they see the numbers, but they are still more some lingering problems with brand creative placement control. That would be really nice for some of our clients who can be Be picky in response to question to Ashton. Clark goes with only tested it for a couple.

17:28 Be to see clients. We have been pleasantly surprised overall still hesitant to use for B2B though. Yeah. People will be surprised that performance Max has been working for a lot of people to be honest Julia voice response to question 3, say not yet but I'm sure it will come up this year. Boris, Becker sponsoring I have to lead gen Pines one tested when it out. I received tons of spam leads would do it totally different today. My e-commerce accounts. It generally does great John, King in response to question 3 saying. Yep. And not so much of a difference, but by more than vertical itself. So not so much of a difference by more than the vertical itself. So the difference is the vertical itself, Dwayne Brown response to question. Three, same P Max can work for e-comm and DTC. You still need the data to make it a success P. Max.

18:19 Not all that standard shopping still works and you can beat pmax in the Right hands. Just running. Only pmac can often get you average results, especially if brand is not removed. So work on those negatives. Then continue says we don't have any AD account only Running P Max. I don't trust Google that much understanding. When to use a tool P, Max versus standard shopping is how we separate the good from amazing campaign managers today. And then Ashton Clark responds to question 3A, saying can't speak to e-comm, but we've tested it for b2c lead gen and seeing good results. Branded We seem to be one of the main conversion drivers, but we also haven't seen a major impact on our brand search campaigns which was interesting, Julie, then takes us on to question for and CC. She goes, I know this question will have lots of answers. What is your biggest challenge when either setting up or managing performance?

19:13 Max campaigns, lots of things, Donna goes. There are many things that can be improved by think the biggest is the ability to see performance / acid groups, which is finally coming soon. This Year and also the inability to add by yourself - keywords. You want managing goes yes, I'm excited for this. Sophia response. Question for saying it would be great to have everything we get to see, thanks to Mike Road, scripts visible in the platform. So yeah, Mike roads, scripts allows you to see a lot more than Google ads allows anyway. Hopefully the changes that are coming up will give us more data to work with. Matt bisque up response saying, setting up to optimize for store visits connecting with Google business.

19:53 Files for accounts that the agency does not own specific issues. Around my agency's work email being Google driven, it sees my email as an old and an org can't get control even management Control. G MBS management goes the business profile. Integration with Google ads is lacking much more complicated than it needs to be Gil response. Question forcing sometimes I just really like to see data and it makes me sad when I can't. Then I get over myself and just start testing. Alfred Simon response to question for as well, saying that we don't see actual data on asset level. I would like to know which picture or video or text is better. We don't see that at the moment. Lord and then to second answer to that, he goes acid, group level reporting happily, this is coming this year, management goes, the biggest ones I run into our how to scale once it's working lead, quality issues for lead gen. Yeah, a lot of people have mentioned that Julia voice response to that to what manage him just said saying someone has Had to have a cost of production chat with a client who's never required video before.

20:58 And it shows these Basics are, just not for every business owner managing goes, add that to the list. Boris also responds saying, I think the setup is actually fairly easy and dictated by the product or targets, the hard part is optimizing with less buttons to push and that's where you can separate yourself from the competition. Mention will respond saying there are more levers available than it seems ad copy and creative. Audience signals, bid strategy, budget data feed, are you shopping lists and groups. IE shopping offline. Conversions are a lead gen. You are URL expansion. Boris goes exactly only cause some of these things on be optimized in the account. Doesn't mean they aren't there.

21:41 Yeah because you can't optimize them doesn't mean they are not there. Ashton clock response to question for saying, the big management challenge is not being able to add campaign level negatives or exclusions other than updating your creative on. And Which you don't get much data on to make an informed decision. It's difficult to really optimize and yeah, medicham gives replies to that answer with the link to that tweet that he just mentioned about more levers available. I ad copy audience signals Etc. So yeah, lots more signals than we actually realize Julia voice response to question for starting with cracks Knuckles. I'm not going to crack my Knuckles. Don't worry. She starts off saying the creative investment much.

22:23 Larger than such dollars to the data set size needed for Success. 3, the account level only negatives insert violent rage. Give hair for risk of overlap with other campaigns with a different goals jail and then managing response. I typically recommend starting with the top performing created from Facebook or Tick-Tock. KV goes there's a great strategy for an already on social smaller business. May I introduce you to channel licensing and sa G / AC tra This nonsense is for neither Enterprise nor SMB yet. What kills me is? It could be good product. Gil, Goose response, take a deep breath. Julia. Ha ha. Ha, Melissa is, what goes all of this? Just not workable for most of our clients. Yeah, a lot of things that doesn't work for clients with very strict goals and very strict, kind of leads that they need.

23:16 So Kirk then replies to question for also replying to Julia vices tweet when she starts off with cracks. Chuckles. And he goes, I like this list. I'd also add to it, the inability to match specific assets to specific. Audiences is a problem with pmags that's marketing 101, segment, a target audience out, and then giving them a unique message audience signal fail hair. So yeah, working on getting that like still. So Google, hopefully working right now to make that happen. I hope so Crossing all my fingers and toes for that being Brown response to question for as well, saying for lat, Traditional search marketers, the creative needed to start, but also maintain it.

23:58 It's very much like Facebook, but we should also ask clients for best Facebook and IG creative to use on P Max, not being able to remove brand and not getting reporting people want. And continuing on from I think not quite the rant but managing, where he said, the biggest ones I run into how to scale once it's working lead quality issues for lead gen Julia voice goes, someone hasn't had to have cost of production chat with a Client who's never required video before, and it shows these Basics are. Just not for every business owner Melissa respond saying video is another huge barrier for B2B clients. Just don't have video assets, sitting around, they barely have image asset, Gill response, but video on P.

24:40 Max is a secret weapon. It works so well. I think was really different about B2B and b2c and I was really noticing that when I saw Amarin, add, you know, video ad in the wild today is that it's really about the, the person, you know, It's really hard to show the product when it's eCommerce, you know, you'd you show the the product you show like a makeup thing, and you show a foundation of lipstick, you pair of shoes and dress kind of thing would be to be. It's really hard to show. Like the product that, you know, that will inspire the person to them by yeah, B2B products. Don't look sexy and appealing. So you really need to Jazz it up with someone dancing, which is what we did.

25:20 Yeah, he'll respond saying yes, pmax video assets to make Dollars loads and loads of dollars. So yeah video I said big win for performance. Max question 5, which I think is our second to last question of today. Julie asks, how long do you wait to judge before the performance of your performance Max campaign? If you are not performing well, what actions do you take to try to improve performance girl responds saying it's more about data and volume than time folks used to say, wait, six weeks or so, but that's outdated. It's sort of changed to a goal. / Air volume approach for us. How to explain in a tweet, but lately we've had P Max campaign. Absolutely slay within one week or so. I love that absolutely Celeste, Leigh, boys, lay till you respond saying for e-commerce, girl, responsive e-commerce, but also be an M retail. One of our clients has lots of locations 75 plus across Canada. And P Max actually works.

26:16 Well, for store visits, we've had these pick up steam really fast, manage a response, saying local campaigns were also, So, rolled into performance Max, I'd imagine that works. Well, don't have much experience. They're managing gives his own. Such question. 5, same performance, Max requires the right data signals and patience. In my experience, it can take three to six weeks to hit its stride wet, it needs help. We focus on these levers and delivers that he mentioned earlier. In terms of the ad, copy audience, signals, etc, etc. Diana respond saying, I usually wait for around six weeks after making a big change. One of the first optimizations is Low performance visuals or copy other things.

26:57 People can play with is testing different audience signals and she continues going I love to use the best-performing audiences in the Insight tab in other non pmax campaigns in the account in an attempt to make the best possible with the few data available. And then we have Julia voice responding to. And I'm very lucky that I use them for Matt search in an ongoing way. So I have month or month and year on year to work out success for shorter campaigns. It's basically once the learning period. It is done, we monitor very closely and then we have Ashton clock responding to question five saying, we give all our new initiatives and test at least four weeks to run mostly unchanged before analyzing the initial results. So, that's how we've approached the P Max. We also do daily checks to make sure spend is okay. And check in at the second week, Mark to make a slight changes if needed when Brown response to question five saying, we still see some An accounts need that, three to four weeks a lot. Comes down to what data you have on. What data the campaign is getting like any Google test, you need at least two weeks of data, without trying to jump the shark on how well something appears to be doing doing bomb continues saying the lack of patience and people saying that. After a week, the P Max is doing good or bad, is the biggest issue.

28:11 The reality is even a to 50,000 per month to add account, should not make a call without a couple weeks of data. We'd never let a client make a call on one week of data, just one week in there. Mullins asked to drain Brown saying it's a tough to tell a client. They need to prepare to lose money for two to four weeks to test pmax, especially if they already have winning campaigns are there kpi's? You recommend monitoring for Trends week on week throughout the testing process Durango's? Any campaign can lose money when you launch at P, Max is not unique in that respect. You are investing money to see if something can perform better. If clients don't want to take that risk then that is okay. And during continue saying, you can look at Upstream numbers like Agency pierrot as conversion rates and those numbers, as long as your Downstream metrics. Like, adspend CTR.

29:00 Cpc's on so forth are staying the same? And then we have ours responding to question five saying. I usually wait, around for weeks give or take before I make optimizations. Obviously this depends on the amount of data you are getting, but that's kinda the ball park. Junkeum response to question for saying, no transparency whatsoever and then Julia gives one question that is A question for questions saying, what questions do you have for many Tim about performance? Max starting off with in Jensen goes, any thoughts on how or if it's worth trying to get P Max to work for a heavily regulated industry with strict compliance guidelines? Imagine gives us a tough one as others have mentioned. I don't think P Max is there yet as it relates to Brand safety and legal until goes.

29:47 Thanks, that's kind of where we're at. Just thought it would be worthwhile to hear any other thoughts. Would be nice to see greater Pull over how assets are displayed to ensure compliance and such so companies with compliance issues and no go. Sofia asks, what's your opinion on - vising brand keywords from P Max? Is there a case in which you wouldn't recommend? It management goes, I don't believe that brand should always be excluded especially with smaller budgets. It's a very important. Bottom funnel signal for the campaign. It's not always worth. The added complexity makes sense to exclude when it's using a large. A portion of overall budgets and not focusing on a new customer acquisition. This is typically the case with larger budgets and Brands and then we have gildner responding to question 6. Saying, scaling is a big issue for pay Max. I saw a great post from PPC crack earlier today. The Ghostbusters one which is sort of what we do with pie. Midlow converting structures.

30:47 Any ideas on scaling, especially for mid-sized to large accounts or 100K to 250,000 dollars? Month or more and they are managing those cocks post is great, P. Max tends to focus on winners segmenting. Non spending products or categories. Into new campaigns can force the system, to spend also, increasing budgets and bids incrementally allows the system to find new audiences without performance during Brown. Also gives a question saying curious, manage him doing anything unique or interesting that you don't see other people. Talking about an interesting thing to test is p Max campaign structures, I like smart shopping structure, plays a big role in scaling tons of options Beyond performance, / roast breakout pmax Prost. Anyway, looking at our notion page on campaign, breakout options, you can test Beyond performance per row. Sr seasonality bestsellers cheapest versus expensive variance on sale versus non on sale. New versus old, you can also mix and Max different breakouts. Zombie skews are bad management goes, I don't see lots of folks talking about social style, no shopping, Performance. Max campaigns using the top creative assets from Facebook or Instagram.

31:58 Agree structure is really important Gringos. That is a very cool idea. And unique test Brands. Try, thanks for sharing. And managing goes, this can work. Well, if you have proven creative from Paid social strong audience, signals unlike shopping. It does not have such intent for targeting audience data is super important here. And on that note, we come to the end of this chat and a great conversation about performance, Max. How to use it, what to test, you know, the like the roadblocks for some people, especially with those in B2B and Lead gen. But yeah, I think one, great important advice that managing gives hair was like bring in or flying data. So you can tie that back in the system knows better.

32:40 How to what to put what optimized towards. So yeah, it's really interesting to see that performance Max is working for a lot of people and it's not surprising. It's one of those things will work for some people work for it won't work for some people. So it's all about In a learning given it I'm to test and learn that the time period that managing gives us four to six weeks which I think is fair, but it's really hard to convince some clients to be like. Yeah, you're not going to see great data for over a month. So yeah, just just hang in there. So it's all about communicating and making sure that you set expectations correctly on that note. I hope you've taken some great takeaways, if you want to hear more tips and how to do performance, Max manage him and Julie will be coming back talking about this exact topic.

33:23 Eric talking about yeah performance Max and wrangling it on Thursday at 4:00 p.m. GMT because yeah, the US have switch clock. So for like the next couple of weeks, it's going to be there 12:00 midday is going to be our 4:00, so 4:00 eastern time for Twitter spaces chat on Thursday. Yeah. If you want to just make any corrections or, you know, hit me up about anything upset here, please do get in touch with me on my handle the marketing, a new or LinkedIn, where we BBC chat Roundup group or you can just DM me. Just look for a marketing honor and I'm sure you'll be able to find information there as well. Yeah, it will also be great from the long-standing members and our new brand brand new listeners to give this podcast a little bit of a Love by leaving a review or a rating.

34:11 If you just go to link tree.com, /p P, c-- chat, it's called Roundup. You will find more information on how to do that, no more information, you'll be able to do that very quickly on Spotify. It's late. They just giving it like a star rating and it takes seconds and just a reminder as well. PPC, live UK. I know you've not heard me talk about that or for the past, half an hour plus PVC live UK's next event is happening on the 31st, for those who thought it was on the 30th, because there's a train strike. We are not having an effect on the 30th anymore, it's going to be on the 31st of March. I'm at 5:30 at the accelerator and showed it, please join us. We are going to be having three, amazing women, who was, you know, celebrating women's History Month, you know, talk.

34:53 To us about, you know, you know, doing data analysis, properly, forecasting. I'm having a good integrated, PPC strategy. So I think it's going to be amazing line-up. We're going to do a panel discussion as well, to really get conversations going about the state of digital currently. I'm thinking, we either talk about performance Max or Microsoft ads Anyway, come to see which one we decided to choose finally, remember for your campaigns and businesses to Glide smoothly. There's a lot of hard work needed beneath the surface, so keep your swans cake. Came by and speak to you next week.